, whether it's greece, whether it's the federal government here in the united states or in some cases some state and local governments, the last few years have really been playing fast and loose with their finances. so they're clamping down precisely, not because of some of the issues the congressman just talked about, but also because governments aren't doing enough to control their finances. you've talked about them earlier. >> neil: you know what's interesting. governor, i know what municipalities are doing and that sort of thing. maybe i'm slow and stupid, congressman was inferring, i think one of the things i took away from that was the fear you lower the top rating of the united states, the banks and institutions, a lot of them, pension funds as well, retirees who hold only triple-a securities and if things get downgraded, they have to dump those securities that were once triple-a, government notes and bonds, they don't have to. >> well, i think there is a real concern, at least, not just from pension funds, but from employers you've talked to about the impact on interest rates,